Industrial engineer Marek Bárdy, CEO of VR Training, combines modern technology with a practical educational approach (the VR School project) and, thanks to the VR Rescue project, contributes significantly to improving first aid skills among the population. “Virtual reality is a welcome and effective addition to traditional classroom teaching. Attractive settings can engage even students who are not interested in or unable to concentrate on traditional presentations. At the same time, VR also works as an individual form of teaching that fully respects the different paces and needs of students,” we read on the project website. In our interview, Marek Bárdy, who is, in his own words, “perhaps the biggest opponent of VR in the end…,” confirms this. You can the full interview on inovujtevpk.cz.
Marek, I ‘ve tried VR Rescue. Even though the virtual environment isn’t perfect and you know it’s not real, it works very well. At least I felt like the things were really happening and every step I took mattered, that I had to do everything right…
We have a new and an old part of the brain. The new part of the brain tells you that it’s a virtual environment, that it’s okay. The old part of the brain, which operates on emotions, reflexes, and instincts, doesn’t know that and doesn’t distinguish this graphic perception, so when you experience it and it has depth—it doesn’t work on a computer in 2D, where it’s perceived as an image—so at that moment of what you’re experiencing, you can tell yourself it’s nonsense, and it doesn’t exist, but you feel the emotion. In extreme cases, such as when you play a shooting game in VR and kill people there, you develop emotional resistance. Emotional resistance also develops with an element of long-term memorability, because you’ve experienced it. It‘s like normal life. When you were at the seaside for the first time, it was one thing, but by the tenth time it was different, and that’s what we are creating. This is exactly what VR does, and it doesn’t matter that it’s painted. After a while, it all blends together and only the emotions remain. I advise parents in schools not to show their children videos of landscapes or the sea, because when they get there, the children won’t get much out of it.
This brings us to the VR School project. How do you see education using augmented reality, and what kind of feedback have you got from kids or teachers?
In general, in what we do, I’m probably the biggest opponent of virtual reality, but at the same time, I don’t want to be part of the crowd. I had a problem with this even at school. I used to ask my teachers why we were learning certain things. In primary school, I found it totally bizarre that I was actually learning something different from what I was writing in a test. I was learning a skill, but was tested on knowledge. These are simply two different concepts that are often completely unrelated. “If I understand mathematics, or can solve a problem, if I know a date by heart, or actually understand history in a way that I can take something away from it… these are simply completely different disciplines. So, even though I’m not a fan of virtual reality, it’s a technology that provides solutions precisely for this kind of ‘bizarre’ situation that’s happening. We sit in training sessions that our employers don’t want to pay for, the instructors are bored, and I don’t listen to what they say, but because that’s how it’s done, we just do it too, like sheep. As for schools, we only do things in VR that don’t make sense in the real world—economically, organizationally, or for safety reasons. In primary schools, it’s natural sciences: stuff that’s abstract and expensive to test, or experiments that are safety-heavy, like chemical ones. There are around 150-170 licenses out there for schools, and it’s good that they are used a lot. In half of the Pilsen schools. We know how to use it. I didn’t really have much faith in it, and we did the project because one day we’ll have kids in school too, and we want those schools to be different. They’re always the same – nothing really changes there. But they use it! The hardest part was that the kids want it—but they’re hard to control—and the teachers definitely don’t want it because it’s new technology. And generally, due to approval processes, schools always end up with the worst technological junk. It’s not like the commercial sector, where you can choose. It just ends up there somehow. They always get the worst junk, and teachers don’t understand it, and don’t know how to use it. We’ve somehow managed to get through this, and it’s now a great starting point for first aid, because we’ve already adapted the education system. We’ve put the energy into it, and VR is no longer science fiction for them. They know how to use it, and, it works. We’ve created a seedbed, and now they are not afraid anymore and can start with the VR first aid training.
After trying VR Rescue, I believe that augmented reality can provide a completely different experience than traditional teaching. It can combine a whole range of subjects, which is great!
There is a trend toward inquiry-based learning. At the same time, primary schools are inclusive, with students of different levels in the same classes. Not all of them can keep up with the lessons, some have assistants. Children feel the imbalance, and some of them are under extreme pressure. VR technology, and this is not my opinion but that of teachers, solves this problem. When children are closed off in the virtual world, they actually get to relax. They allow themselves to make mistakes because they are not under pressure, standing in front of the class with everyone watching them. They relax and can focus on the subject matter in peace. In addition, the programmes are adapted so that even the slowest learners can keep up. Everyone moves at their own pace, and the best ones get something extra. The session is designed to last 15 minutes, for example, 15 minutes for everyone. The good ones have access to exercises that have no end. Then they all take it off and no one knows what activities the others have done.
I realize that some children simply don’t have access to technology, and the gap keeps widening. Can this way even give less privileged kids higher goals?
In the VR environment, all the children are equal. VR isn’t so common that kids would have it at home—it’s not like video games. Some parents simply won’t buy it for their children. Children are not so crazy about it either, as it is difficult to access, so it hasn’t really taken off. When schools offer virtual reality, they bring them total hi-tech. Even the content is more hi-tech than the games they have at home. At school, they no longer show them a stuffed fox. In the eyes of children, school grows in stature because it provides them with something they would otherwise never have the chance to experience. I would add that VR technology is simply a computer, and we teach schools not to work only with our applications, but to use it to teach computer literacy in general. They can teach geography using beautiful Google maps. In short, they should work with it as a tool; that’s what it’s open for.
At the VR Rescue 1000 project conference, you said that you don’t want to change people’s character. Can you elaborate on that?
I see people as a black box. To be honest, and I’m saying this out loud, so far, I couldn’t care less if they take a first aid course because it’s trendy and they post it on Facebook, or because it makes them feel good. I just want them to do it. If it means we need a fancy website with a picture of an influencer taking the course… fine with me. I look at it purely statistically, I don’t judge. I ‘m focused on the goal. People run a lot because of smartwatches that are connected to social media. They run, great, they’re doing something.
I like that you don’t have any illusions — you work with what’s actually there.
When you’re in opposition to something — anything, even in politics — the moment you just comment on things, you’re not actually doing anything; you’re in opposition. Nobody cares. I could build a career out of being a loudmouth, but the real result would be zero. If I try to change people’s nature and keep saying that social media are bad, people will agree with me — but that’s all.
You also said that you don’t understand technology or healthcare, and that’s why you don’t see many of the obstacles — which, if I understand correctly, actually makes you a successful product creator or project manager?
Exactly. Recently, a hospital director visited us and said he had an idea – we could do this and that. He is very smart, a doctor, but having worked as a hospital director for a long time, he thinks more out of the box and has the necessary perspective. I look at a person — a patient — from the outside. I’m not interested in how things work inside the body, because then you get too focused on physiology, medication, and all that. We try not to get bogged down. When experts start explaining how something in the body works, we don’t want to hear it. For instance, Professor Beneš — the best doctor I know — is truly excellent. He understands that someone else may not understand his field. Few people who are really good at what they do can do that. He explained to us how the brain works. And he told me that he could see the blank look on my face and that we’d have to approach it differently. Then he explained it to me in a very simple way — so that I could really understand it.
Many people don’t know how to pass on their knowledge or give clear instructions — it’s not easy…
Or they’re afraid to admit that they don’t understand something… that’s quite common too.
“Our work is all about constantly coming up with new ideas and pushing boundaries.”
You explained to me how the brain works. You mentioned the example with glasses. Many people see glasses as half empty, you seem to see them as half full, am I right?
Definitely — otherwise it wouldn’t be possible. The nature of this work… and I guess this is true for every boss… I have to convince customers, partners, investors, whoever, about something I believe in, even though deep down I know it’s incredibly difficult. And then I also have to tell my team that everything’s totally fine. So, if it weren’t based on a positive foundation, it wouldn’t be possible to pull it off. Our job is about constantly coming up with new ideas and pushing boundaries. Fortunately, it’s been working and we have something to fall back on. When people don’t believe it can be done, you can rely on the fact that it’s already worked several times before.
A pioneer of innovative education through VR, Ing. Marek Bárdy, Ph.D., CEO and managing partner of VR Training, completed his PhD at the Faculty of Mechanical Engineering of the UWB in Pilsen, where he took an active interest in implementing new technologies in education already during his studies. His company is behind the VR Rescue project, which, in collaboration with the University Hospital in Pilsen, the Czech Red Cross, the City of Pilsen, and technology partners, brings a revolutionary first aid training programme. It features a “virtual trainer” capable of teaching users the basic steps of first aid in about 15 minutes — including assessing the situation, checking for breathing, and performing resuscitation.
VR Training / VR School
VR is a great educational tool. It allows pupils and students to experience situations that would otherwise be dangerous, expensive, or impossible in real life – from chemical experiments and trips to space to walking through Africa or exploring a 3D model of the heart, etc. The possibilities for using VR in schools are limitless. As a result, it can be applied effectively in primary schools, secondary schools, and grammar schools alike. Virtual reality reliably captures students’ interest, engages them, and, through direct experience, conveys the desired information to a larger number of learners. This makes it an ideal complement to traditional classroom teaching.
